The Poll: Allow E.S. or disallow ?

[euklidis]

i have to go with the third... they can post them but with no points... I've said it before... you can't buy ES so easy, and if you find one it will already be tested

[Kal-EL]

Originally Posted by Hollywood

My vote goes for the first option.
I rly don't mind if the top clockers, or anyone else, use ES hardware, cherry gfx or whatever.
To me it looks like this: I like to see whats possible and what the top guys can manage with that kind of hw.
I'll never be able to compete with the top guys. Even if i had plenty of ES hw.
It's the skill, wich keeps the top guys up there, not just cherry hw.
So, keep pushing the shit out of these kind of hardware!

Hollywood

If you were competing on a retail platform with no hardware support from manufacturers, you would care a great deal about improving the playing field. Its easy to sit back in the rankings and chalk it up to "Its great to see the great scores". But if you're getting close to the top end of the rankings with hopes of breaking into the top ten, you'd be pretty disheartened to continue while getting slapped around by ES chips you have no access to.

Sure you could ebay some reject ao's or find some black market dealer in Taiwan but odds are you won't get anywhere decent.

TO me, I see manufacturers investments in top tier overclockers for marketing purposes. Manufacturer after manufacturer looking for the next world record to market their wares. So they support their overclockers and support them well. This is awesome, we get to see wicked prototype hardware doing amazing things on Ln2.

I guess the question really boil down to:

Why do you submit benchmarks to hwbot?

[Patch]

Originally Posted by HawaiiSuperman

Why do you submit benchmarks to hwbot?

Supes says it right there.

In the last year I've purchased gobs of retails and a few ES's from ebay. The best chips I've gotten have been lucky retails from a retailer. Every second hand chip has been a complete or relative dud, despite the advertised claims.

It's a myth that good ES's are available to anyone. Any ES on ebay has already been binned and rejected by someone else. And, you're not even supposed to buy em anyway.

Officially, ES chips are the property of the manufacturer. If they are going to be allowed on the bot, then Intel should open an account and get the points whenever a bench is submitted with one.

But hey, as long as they're accepted I'll keep trying to get em.

[Alriin]

I think it's not fair. So disallow them!

[Gautam]

It doesn't matter Bill. If you disallow ESes, there will just be corporate retail binning. It won't change a thing.

[BenchZowner]

Originally Posted by Gautam

It doesn't matter Bill. If you disallow ESes, there will just be corporate retail binning. It won't change a thing.

It does, partially though.
The best retail won't be as far as the E.S.'s are.
Plus, with some help of a golden hand aka tsan you can find a decent retail in 1-2 tries ( man tsan's the luckiest person I've ever met, just let him pick up the CPU/VGA for you... ).

I'd rather go 6.2GHz 3D vs 6.4-6.5GHz 3D than 6.2GHz vs 6.7GHz.

Corporate binning will always be here, but they don't get to test every chip that gets out of the production facility, and sometimes some of those are gems, real gems

[Hollywood]

Originally Posted by Gautam

It doesn't matter Bill. If you disallow ESes, there will just be corporate retail binning. It won't change a thing.

That's so true!

Btw, its not that easy to sit in the back of the rankings with no chance to get up.
I have spend thousands of euros over the last month for my overclocking hobby.
And that's what it is to me, a hobby.
Two GT's died on me within a few weeks. Several mainboards and graficcards as well.
It's not easy to effort the money for that, but i do, cause of the fun i have.
If you had a racingteam, with superior tyre manufacture, wich gives u an advance of a sec per lap,
and its within the rules, u would be mad if they would ban them.
I dont care about that. Ppl like me, and there are thousands, bench just for fun.
Fair or not, i would like to see the big numbers coming.
I said in in my first post within this thread; i would not be able to compete with the guys on top.
Even if i had ES hardware or not. And i rly thing that this counts for the most of benchers around the world.
This is just what i think. If others think diff, its okay to me.
To me, there is a bigger problem with cheating than with ES or non ES hardware.


best regards

[der8auer]

I've often asked to disallow ES CPUs in the past. So thanks for starting this poll

First i thought about "totally disallow them". But i've got no disadvantage if they are part of hwbot without points.

Just an example:
i7-965 retail CPUs are C0 stepping. But there are ES Samples in D0 stepping which clock much better than normal retail CPUs... So there is a real disadvantage for normal folks...

[Bobnova]

I am not a fan of ES stuff being on HWBot, when some people are getting free kilobuck cpus it's mighty hard to compete against them without a ton of money, and some ES stuff is simply untouchable by retail as mentioned before.
As manufacturers get more into OCing i expect to see more and more specially binned "ES" samples being sent to people. The more that happens, the less chance there is for a mere mortal to even get close to a WR, regardless of skill or money.

ES has no place on HWBot.

[Hollywood]

Originally Posted by der8auer

I've often asked to disallow ES CPUs in the past. So thanks for starting this poll

First i thought about "totally disallow them". But i've got no disadvantage if they are part of hwbot without points.

Just an example:
i7-965 retail CPUs are C0 stepping. But there are ES Samples in D0 stepping which clock much better than normal retail CPUs... So there is a real disadvantage for normal folks...

Sure it is, no doubt. But to be honest; do you rly think, that you could compete with the top guys if you had the same hw?
It's more than just the hw to take a top spot.
Ladies, this is just hwbot. And i dont say that in a bad way.
Benching and overclocking is a very big part in my life.
But there is much more than just that.

I'll try to give u another example: Take the Fermi slow cold bug. Some of the top clockers know how to handle it and take a huge advantage.
Most of us dont know how to get rid of that.
So, as most of us dont know how to manage big clocks with these cards, it should be banned?
There are plenty of great retail GT's out there.
To me, it doesnt make any diff: ES or retail binning.

best regards

Hollywood